88 Cutlass Resto-Mod Project Thread - 56K DIE!

[LWillmann]

I'm making some progress on my Cutty!

I got my heads back from the machine shop (FINALLY)... Snapped a few pics of them with my camera phone (no batteries for my digital camera at the time). I had to get them taped and painted ASAP because of the humidity they were already trying to start rusting.

Here's the first 4 pics, before painting:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_1b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_1c.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_1d.jpg

The heads are just 88 GTA heads that have been milled .010 to clean up the surface, had springs installed to handle the cam that I'm running in the engine that's going in the car.

Believe me, these heads were NASTY when they were given to me.

[LWillmann]

Here's the next 4, before painting:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_1e.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_2a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_2b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_2c.jpg

[LWillmann]

Last 1, before painting:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/lee_head_2d.jpg

And last night, I got them both taped, and one of them fully painted.

Using 3 coats of 500 degree Ceramic Enamel primer with 3 coats of 500 degree Ceramic Enable low gloss black.

Hopefully it should do the trick.

The can says the paint has to cure for 5 days.

I plan to get the other head painted tonight.

Will try to get batteries for the digital tonight too if at all possible so I can get pics of the freshly painted heads.

[badjuju342]

Lookin' good . I always find when you finally start getting somewhere on project , you get motivated until the next headache....

[89RABIDFOX]

Well I Can Relate To That Statement. I Always Enjoy Working On My Car Til Another Headache Comes On And Then I Dont Want To Mess With It At All.

[LWillmann]

In my case, since I suffer from Migraines, when the next headache comes on, I kinda have to keep on going, LOL.

I lucked out on the heads. A guy gave them to me, so I'm only out $275 to the machine shop for the springs, valve stem seals and actual clean up work. So I figure $275 for a good set of iron heads isn't too bad. Now they're not a GREAT set of heads, but they'll do me till I can afford a better set, for sure.

I already have my headers on hand, just need to get them somewhere to get the rust knocked off so I can get them primed and painted too. I know it won't hold up for long, but I figured I'd paint them with the 1200 degree ceramic stuff, or something along those lines. I can't afford to have them coated. I gotta do this stuff on the cheap right now.

All I need to do to get the factory engine and trans out of the car is to pull the motor mount through bolts out, lift the trans off the cross member and slide the crossmember out of there. Oh, there's one bracket I may have to cut first. Then it's time to lift the engine and trans outta there!

[BuiltLT1]

Looking good man! Those are some small looking combustion chambers. What are they? 64cc? That and the little bit of milling should give you some good compression.

[LWillmann]

Thanks Mitchell!

Everything I've read says they're 64cc, but the guy at the machine shop swears they're 76cc. I'll do a side by side comparison of the 333882's I have which I KNOW are 76's and we'll see which ones have bigger chambers tonight.

In the mean time, I have some more pics for you guys...

The first ones are of the second head after the first coat of primer last night. I never did get any shots of it after the color coats, but I'll get pics of it tonight after I pull the tape off. I realized that I taped too much area on the exhaust side of the head, so I'll have to do some touch up I guess. But now that I've gone this far with them, I have to let the paint cure for 5 days before doing any more painting (at least that's what the can says).

Anyway, on to the pics:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_primed_1a.JPG
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_primed_1b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_primed_1c.jpg

[LWillmann]

Here's a couple of pictures of the engine bay as it sits right now. The old engine is ready to come out. The only thing holding it in there are the through bolts to the motor mounts, LOL.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_bay_1.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_bay_2.jpg

[LWillmann]

And here are a few pictures of the new shortblock. Not too much to look at really, but it should be looking more complete here really soon once the heads go on it.

I'll have to modify my Edelbrock intake to work with the heads, but that shouldn't be a problem.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_shortblock_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_shortblock_1b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_shortblock_1c.jpg

[badjuju342]

Wowzers , you are kicking it up into high gear...

[LWillmann]

Well, the engine bay has been like that for about a month now. And the shorblock has been assembled for a long time, just waiting for heads.

So it's not like I'm in real high gear here. LOL...

I'm just wanting to get stuff done on it... I'm driving a borrowed pickup truck and would like to get out of it and into my own car sometime soon. Maybe I can start driving the Cutty in the spring?

I have the brackets and most of the accessories for the serpentine setup, I have the electric fans from my LT1 car still and will be trying to adapt them to this car.

Still have lots of stuff to get yet though. Like a carb, valve covers, air cleaner, and such. Still a long way to go yet. I am still wrestling with rebuilding the transmission now or later. Do it once later, or twice (stock rebuild now to get me by, and a high performance rebuild later). The trans has 223,000 miles on it, and it was doing ok, but I worry about the added HP and TQ behind the 350. But it's not cheap to rebuild a trans, and that means more money and more time waiting to get it back on the road. So that's more to think about...

I'll probably do a stock rebuild, with a new stock converter for now, then a high perf rebuild later and a high-stall 'verter later, when I get better heads.

[LWillmann]

Thought I would add some more like I promised tonight...

Ok, here are the painted heads:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_painted_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_painted_1b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_painted_1c.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_painted_1d.jpg

The hard part is going to be waiting 5 days for the paint to cure before bolting these suckers to the engine.

[LWillmann]

And here is the comparison between the TPI head and a KNOWN 76cc head (333882 casting)...

From comparing the two, I firmly believe that the TPI head is a 64cc head. Look at the placement of the valves in relation to the side of the chamber where the plug is, much closer on the TPI head, yet the other end of the chamber isn't proportionally longer on the TPI head than the 882's. Also, I compared the depth of the chamber on the two, they're similar, which tells me that the 083's (the TPI heads) have a shorter chamber, making the valves closer to the plug, and making the chamber smaller.

I think you can tell by looking which head is which, LOL

Anyway, here are the pics:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_compare_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_compare_1b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/heads/head_compare_1c.jpg

[LWillmann]

Made some more progress on the engine last night.

Finally got the heads bolted down.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/heads_on_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/heads_on_1b.jpg

[LWillmann]

Then I decided to sit the intake on it and check the alignment on the bolt holes.

Since I'm using 88 GTA heads and a pre-86 intake, I'll have to modify the center bolt holes so I can bolt it down.

Here's a few pics of the engine with the intake sitting on the engine:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/intake_alignment_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/intake_alignment_1b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/intake_alignment_1c.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/intake_alignment_1d.jpg

[89RABIDFOX]

Looks Like It Is Coming Along Pretty Good For You.

[LWillmann]

Well, yesterday I made a little run to Nashvegas and helped a guy swap his stock LT1 valve covers to some Edelbrock Elite series covers. That got me some free center bolt covers :rockon: .

After that, the family and I went to Hooters for lunch :rockon: :drunk:

Then came home and put the last few fittings on my filter-oiler for my air tools, and put my other large filter together, so now I can plumb them both in and switch them back and forth. I have quick disconnects on them both so I can switch from one to the other as needed, based on the tool I'm using.

I then set the intake and valley pan rail gaskets on the block and set the intake back down on it and stuck a few bolts into it to line it up. That gave me a real good look at how much trimming I'm gonna have to do to get the bolt holes lined up on the centers.

It's not as bad as it first looked really.

Here are a couple of pics of the filter and filter-oiler I mentioned above:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/tools/filter.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/tools/filter_oiler.jpg

[LWillmann]

Then today, after sitting around a while and getting bored (cause my laptop is in Cali being repaired by the manufacturer and I can't do any work for my clients :( ), I got started doing a little work on the car. :wrenchbanana:


And here's what I got accomplished:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_removal_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_removal_1b.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_removal_1c.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_removal_1d.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_removal_1e.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/engine_removal_1f.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/empty_bay_1a.jpg
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/empty_bay_1b.jpg

My wife helped a bit to tug and direct the engine and hoist and such, but it only took me 3 hours to get the garage straightened up enough and get the engine fully out and down onto the pallet on the floor.

Granted, I'm gonna have to pick it back up to get the converter off the flexplate so I can seperate the trans from the engine, but that shouldn't be too bad.

It feels good to have that sucker out of there!!!

[LWillmann]

I've made some huge progress!

Not so much on the car, but on the garage!

Not too long after getting the heads on the new engine, my grandmother needed me to change the water pump on her Buick, so I had to roll the Cutlass out of the garage.

Rolled it out, and moved the Buick in for a couple of days while I did the water pump, new radiator hoses, thermostat, and a couple of other things. After getting that work done, my wife, myself, and a friend of ours decided it was time to clean up the garage. It hadn't been done since the Firebird was totalled (the one STILL showing up in my sig...), about two years now actually since it had gotten a real good cleaning.

So I went and bought 4 sets of these steel and wood shelves, each set is rated for 1,000 pounds per shelf or 5,000 pounds per unit. After getting them, and bringing them home, we started the process of cleaning the garage. We did one side first. Basically we moved almost everything from one section on one side to the center of the garage, swept that area, then built the shelves and loaded the shelves. We put garbage in the garbage pile, and then moved on to the next area on that same side.

We managed to get one side fone the first night, and the other side done about a week later (I work two jobs so it took me a little time to get back to it). Once we got it done, we moved the Cutlass back into the garage.

All in all, it took us a couple of weeks of tinkering and piddling with the garage to get it all cleaned up and ready.

I have added 4 hanging 4-foot fluorescent shop lights also. I needed more light out there, and that really made a difference. All that's left to clean is my work bench, then I can build the hutch to go over it, so that I can hang the light over it, and then the garage should be good to go.

I have some pictures of the garage after the cleaning, with the lights up both off and on, so you can see the difference that the lights make out there.

EDIT, Here are the pics:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/garage/pic_1_lights_on.JPG

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/garage/pic_2_lights_on.JPG

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/garage/pic_3_lights_on.JPG

[LWillmann]

I have also done a little engine work too. Not too much just yet, but have some more work coming soon.

I ordered a pushrod measuring tool from Summit and used it to determine what length pushrod I needed for the motor, and went and got them. Turned out that a stock pushrod was good enough.

At the same time, I ordered a good set of rubber valve cover gaskets. No cork for me. Also ordered a set of ARP valve cover bolts.

Once I knew the pushrod length, I went and got some stock SBC 7.794" pushrods, cleaned up my rockers, fulcrums, and rocker nuts, and put the valvetrain together. I left the rockers ever to slightly loose so there is some slack there for when the lifters pump up. Then I put the valve covers on it and snugged them down.

I didn't bother to take pictures of that since there's not much to see.

But yesterday I ordered a few parts that will definitely be picture worthy.

Ordered an intake manifold, Edelbrock Performer carb, and an air cleaner for the engine. Those items should be here tomorrow, and knowing me, I'll have them on the motor tomorrow night if I can, LMAO.

Once that stuff is in place, I can get the distributor hold down kit, put the dizzy in there, and go to work on the front of the engine.

That leaves the crank pulley, water pump, accessory brackets, etc.

Seems like it's getting close...

[SuedN1]

I admire your skill, and determination and wish you only the best in this labor of love. It has to be a labor of love---why else would you clean the garage? :)

[LWillmann]

Well, the new parts came in this afternoon. I pulled each of them out and inspected them. I took the intake to the garage and sat it on the engine and threaded a couple of bolts into the heads to see how it fit.

I then made myself a small shopping list of other parts that I needed, and made a run to the parts store. Picked up a new heavy duty water pump, and a few other odds and ends, then came home and did some test fitting and took some pictures.

The Summit Stage 1 intake seems quite well made actually, with seemingly very little casting flash in the ports.

Pictures of the intake:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_6.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_7.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_8.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_9.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_10.jpg

[LWillmann]

After taking those pictures, I took the intake out and set it on the engine and run a few bolts in part way to check alignment.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_11.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_12.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_13.jpg

Then I installed the carb studs I picked up on my little parts run, and I set the carb in place on the intake.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_14.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_15.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_16.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_17.jpg

After that, I tried the air cleaner stud that was included with the air cleaner, only to find out that it was too short, so I used the one that was included with the carb, and it was long enough, but I think just barely, LOL.

Here are a few pics with the air cleaner in place:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_18.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_19.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_20.jpg

[MrDavid]

Your intake and carb setup looks pretty killer on top of the blacked out engine.

[LWillmann]

A friend of mine thinks I should have my valve covers chromed to go with the air cleaner.

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Looks Good To Me Man. Keep It Up!!!

[john_d.]

Looking good Lee.

Are you going to do any additional cleanup work on those intake ports? (i.e. like gasket matching?)
They look pretty close already, just like you said, a little bit of casting flash.

[The EnforceR]

i say chrome the valve covers, looks too much like a plain jane crate motor with the black ones. you can pick up chrome ones pretty cheap, or just get those chromed.

[LWillmann]

i say chrome the valve covers, looks too much like a plain jane crate motor with the black ones. you can pick up chrome ones pretty cheap, or just get those chromed.

Seems like everybody has chrome valve covers though. I just don't want to be like everyone else.

So I'm thinking about fabricated aluminum valve covers. :drool:

Like these: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=SUM%2D440605&N=700+4294919746+4294903281+4294908395+4294900056+ 115&autoview=sku

[choppeds10]

i love the way aluminuw valve covers look go for it

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Yeah That's Pretty Good Looking. I Agree Be Different.

[LWillmann]

I do like these though: http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?autofilter=1&part=SUM%2DG3314&N=700+4294919746+4294903281+4294908395+4294908216+ 115&autoview=sku

I need to just get the car running though, so in the interest of keeping it as inexpensive as possible, I will run what I have for now. Once I get the car up and running, then I can worry about getting some new valve covers for it.

I ordered the new torque converter for the car tonight.

I know the transmission as it sits will never live behind the engine, so I have to have it rebuilt. Since I'm going to rebuild it, I'm going to rebuild it right. Doing a Pro-Built Automatics Pro-Street kit good for around 600 HP :D

And while I'm at it, I'm doing an Edge Racing Street Edge 3200 RPM 9.5" Lockup converter.

So the converter is on order, and should ship in about 5 business days. So hopefully I'll have it by the end of next week.

[choppeds10]

valve covers can always be changed at anytime man i understand about the money

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Sounds Sweet Willmann!!!

[john_d.]

One thing to think about with chrome, is that they can be harder to get to seal...

[LWillmann]

I'll keep that in mind John, thanks for the heads up.

[The EnforceR]

yea those alum valve covers with the exposed welds look great.

[WhiteIrocZ]

I have always liked the look of fabricated valve covers. They have inset holes for the bolts to make the valve covers look bigger. They also seal great.

[LWillmann]

And yet more progress today!

I bought some headers a while back, but they were a bit rusted and somewhat scaley (sp?). I only paid $75 for them though, so I can't complain. :D

I found a local guy that does sandblasting.

Since my valve covers had some rust spots, worn and bubbling paint, I loaded them and the headers and took them to the sandblaster this afternoon after work today.

$40 later, this is what I have:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/fresh_blast_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/fresh_blast_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/fresh_blast_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/fresh_blast_4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/fresh_blast_5.jpg

The guy that did the work told me that the headers were chrome at one point, and I asked if he was sure if they were chrome or if he meant ceramic coated. He said he was sure they were chrome with they way the stuff peeled off. He said it would take all day to get all of that stuff off the headers, and that it would be fine to paint over what's left, and that's why they have the uneven looking surface. There are some spots where the blaster couldn't quite get to, like down in the nooks where the primaries come together at the collector, but I think they turned out pretty good.

I'm going to paint the headers and valve covers in 'Aluminum' color. 1200 degree ceramic spray paint for the headers, and 500 degree ceramic spray paint for the valve covers. I did the valve covers on my LT1 car that way and they turned out pretty good, and held up well. Hopefully the headers will hold up for a couple of years till I can afford to buy some new ceramic coated ones.

[MrDavid]

This thread definantly needs a title that says: "56K STAY OUT!"

[LWillmann]

That better? LOL

[MrDavid]

Much!

[LWillmann]

Primed the headers and valve covers yesterday.

Three coats of 1200* ceramic primer on the headers results in this:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/primer_coat_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/primer_coat_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/primer_coat_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/primer_coat_4.jpg

And three coats of 500* primer on the valve covers gets me this:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/primer_coat_5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/primer_coat_6.jpg

Now, I have to wait a week for the primer to fully cure, then I can lay the paint down on them. So, next Saturday I will be spraying again.

I also did some sanding on the roof of the car to see just how deep the rust goes, and it's not really that bad, I just really need to get all my sanding stuff in so I can get going on the body work.

[CobraGT]

My brother inlaw has an 87 442 that he dropped a Caddy 500 in. It's a monster.

[LWillmann]

That's sweet!

I had considered getting an Olds engine to drop in, since all the external stuff is a direct swap, but the performance parts for Olds engines is more expensive than the SBC stuff, and it's more difficult to find too. So I opted for the SBC.

I picked up brake parts for the 3.73 rear yesterday. Got the drums, shoes, and wheel cylinders. I want to order the performance girdle for the rear, and the new bushings for the rear end too. But I'm holding off till I get the trans sorted out.

I still need to drop the pan on the trans and get the valve body code and see what the speedo drive gear is, and get that info to the transmission kit guy so I can get the proper rebuild kit ordered. I think the trans rebuild kit is the last of the MAJOR purchases.

There are still plenty of expensive things to buy, but I think that's the last of the $500+ items to get for now.

[CobraGT]

I know he blew up the stock trans. and bought a hi po one. Here is a link to his pics.http://web.tampabay.rr.com/olds442/

[LWillmann]

Got the paint on the headers and valve covers today, and they turned out pretty good!

So the headers will hang for a week to cure, and the valve covers will sit where they are for a week while they cure. Next weekend, I can put the clear on the valve covers.

It's funny how the 1200* paint is shinier than the 500* paint.

Here are the pics:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/header_paint_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/header_paint_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/header_paint_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/header_paint_4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/header_paint_5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/header_paint_6.jpg

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Sweet Pics Of The Work. All Of That Will Be Nice When Done.

[MrDavid]

Wow. That is pretty interesting how the high temp paint is shiner than the lower temp paint. I would have never guessed.

[LWillmann]

Well, since my last post here I have made progress...

I clearcoated the valve covers last weekend, but didn't see much reason to post pics since you couldn't really see much change.

This last week has been hell though!

First, I tried to mount the crank pulley on the balancer and discovered that one of the bolt holes was stripped. That, plus the fact that the rubber ring was starting to deteriorate led me to decide to replace the balancer.

So I picked up a new balancer, and balancer removal tool. When I removed the old balancer, I discovered the crank snout was scarred like someone had grabbed the crank with a pipe wrench or something. Got the new balancer about half way on and got the balancer bolt started, and started pulling it on with the bolt using a socket wrench. When it got too hard to pull by hand, I got the impact gun. Well, my impact gun was too weak so we had to get a better one. Got that one and hit it with it. It went to a point and just stopped before the balancer had gone all the way on. We pulled the bolt back out and discovered that the threads inside the crank had come apart on the bolt.

So the next day (Tuesday), I got a tap and a new balancer bolt and we chased the threads real good. The threads appeared to be good all the way in. This time we managed to get the balancer all the way on without using the bolt at all. So we put the pulley on there and run the bolt in, but it wouldn't tighten up, just spun and spun. We came to the decision that we had to drill and tap to the next largest bolt size.

So on Wednesday, I pick up a small (40-piece) tap and die set, so I get the proper tap size (1/2-20 is the next size up from the SBC balancer bolt), then I have to hunt down a 29/64" drill bit (Lowe's) in the next town and the started the hunt for the proper length bolt. Since we thought we might have bottomed the bolt out, we decided to get a bolt that was 1/4 inch shorter to start with. I couldn't find the bolt on Wednesday, but did on Thursday. We did at least get the crank drilled and partially tapped (just not tapped far enough).

On Thursday, I picked up a 1/2-20 x 2" bolt and we tried it, but discovered that it wasn't long enough when the lock washer and big washer was in place. If I took the lock washer out, I could thread it into the crank. I also discovered that we didn't tap the crank far enough, so we tapped the crank further, too.

Then today, I picked up a 1/2-20 x 2.5" bolt (2.25" bolt isn't available at the bolt place, and ARP sells 2.447" or so long bolts anyway). When I got home, I did a test fit with the longer bolt and it looks good, but it looks like the shorter bolt was just BARELY missing thread engagement.

I also got the balancer, crank and water pump pulleys ready for paint.

Got my starter and alternator at work this week too.

Just got to get the power steering pump pulley and the idler pulleys off so I can get them ready for paint.

Oh, and now for your viewing pleasure.... The pictures of the finished valve covers sitting on the engine, with the bolts. Sure did make a huge difference!

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/vc_after_paint_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/vc_after_paint_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/vc_after_paint_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/vc_after_paint_4.jpg

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Man That Thing Is Looking Good!!!

[89RABIDFOX]

Looking Good Man. Cant Wait To See It In The Car.

[Uncle Paul]

One of these days I will remember to check on those accesory bolts/studs for ya.

I was in the shop today but got so busy with stuff that I forgot to look in the shed at the motor for you. :(

I haven't forgotten about ya, and from the looks of things, you are making hella progress!

So when am I going to get to tear into that tranny?

[LWillmann]

Yeah, I could really use those studs and brackets, so if you get a chance and can remember, please check on them.

I've been making small bits of progress.

Took the serpentine brackets to work and had the wheelabrated to remove the dirt and oil and crap from them. Got them home and primed them this weekend.

Also primed the water pump too.

Got the power steering pump, and the tensioner pulley and the little cover plate for it primed as well.

So I *think* I have everything else that will be painted in primer now, at least for the engine anyway.

Everything but the water pump is going to be black, and that will be silver. It might be difficult to picture, but imagine this:

Black block, black heads, black brackets, black PS pump, black pulleys.

Silver intake, valve covers, timing cover, water pump, carb, air cleaner, and headers.

I figured with all the stuff on the front being black, I needed something to break it up, and the water pump was it.

Oh, and you should get the trans as soon as I can get the rebuild kit. I HAD the money, but the van had to have some emergency repairs, so that put the rebuild kit on hold for the short term.

[Uncle Paul]

I should be back in the shop in the morning. I will try to remember to go in there and see what I have.
No rush on the tranny. Whenever you are ready. :)

[LWillmann]

I got my rebuild kit ordered.

Ordered the full street/strip 550HP+ kit from ProBuilt with the Superior SuperServo.

It includes all kinds of parts for the trans, and you guys that have ordered from Dana knows that he sells quality stuff. I ordered it last week, but it hasn't gotten here yet, but from looking at my bank account online, it looks like I should be getting it soon, because I see the charge is going to be hitting my account soon.

I also got the ATSG book for my rebuilder (Paul).

I then placed an order from another 200-4R guy for some other parts that Dana doesn't carry. Got a Monte Carlo SS governor for higher RPM shifting (5500-5800 versus the 3500 that the Cutlass does now) and the speedo gears that I need for the rear end swap. Also got a new lockup solenoid and a full bushing/washer kit for the entire trans, to make sure that there's not too much play in there. And I got an extra santoprene pan gasket for when I do that 500 mile fluid swap after the rebuild.

Also, all the brackets and pulleys and the water pump are now painted as well. Just waiting for the paint to finish curing on them. I'll post some pictures here in a few so you guys can see them.

And I got my bolt order in from Bolt Depot, so I should have all the bolts I need to get the accessory brackets and stuff bolted to the front of the engine.

Now I have to get the fuel system done, probably going to go with the Holley HP150 kit, like someone recommended, and put a blockoff plate on the engine, and then I'll have to get a regulator, and get some header bolts. For those, I want to get Breslins again, because I had such great luck with them the first time.

Here are the pics:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/painted_parts_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/painted_parts_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/painted_parts_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/painted_parts_4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/painted_parts_5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/painted_parts_6.jpg

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Looks Great Willmann, Keep Us Posted!!!

[LWillmann]

Ordered some more parts for the car today, and a few things for me.

For the car, I ordered:
Bilstein HD Shocks all the way around
Eibach Pro Kit
Suspension Techniques Front 1-3/8" Sway Bar
Suspension Techniques Rear 1" Sway Bar
Holley HP 150 billet fuel pump (thanks for the recommendation guys!)
TrickFlow Aluminum differential cover with bearing cap support.
Top fender trim to replace the missing piece from the car.

For me, I ordered a new Dell x51v PDA (I'm such a geek, LOL), and a case.

I hope to start putting the front of the engine together tonight when I get home from my service call after work.

I've got a call in to a wheel place about a set of wheels and tires for the car too. That right there, will more than wipe out my IRS money, but I'll have done my part to help the economy. LOL.

[RamAirGod]

Sweet, i cant wait til the finished product

[LWillmann]

Monday night, we got the halfway done with the front of the engine. I think the baby ran off with the pulley installation kit for the power steering pump, so we had to stop for the night, but we got the A/C bracket, A/C delete pulley, water pump and its pulley, balancer and crank pulley installed at least.

Yesterday, I took the alternator bracket with PS pump, the PS pulley to AZ and had them install the pulley for me. With that done I went back home and got that bracket installed, the alternator installed, and that finished up the front of the engine.

Then I decided to sit the carb and air cleaner on the engine. My friend figured what the hell and set the distributor down into the hole so it looked right (or reasonably so), and we snugged up the headers. Then snapped off a few pictures.

And here's how it looks:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/almost_done_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/almost_done_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/almost_done_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/almost_done_4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/almost_done_5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/almost_done_6.jpg

Oh, and all my stuff from Summit is out for delivery now.. :D

[RamAirGod]

sweeeeeeet

[Nauty99SS]

:thumbs up:very nice !

[The EnforceR]

the finsih line is getting closer!

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

That's Just Awesome!!!

[LWillmann]

You guys aren't gonna believe this!

Well my shipment from Summit came in, and everything was great, except for one thing...

The front sway bar was damaged in shipment. I'm not sure how it happened either.

The new bar is 35mm and solid. However, still it was damaged in shipment.

Check out the pictures of it below:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_21.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_22.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_23.jpg

And here's the new fuel pump... I took a picture of it beside this quart of oil for comparison sake:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/new_engine/new_parts_24.jpg

[MrDavid]

That looks like some really cheap paint on the sway bar. Did Macco do it? And it looks like it broke clean in half from the first pic. It must have taken a hefty fall at some point.

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Yeah Definitely Or Something Hefty Fell Directly On It. Sorry About That Willmann But Everything Does Look Good.

[LWillmann]

I did some work on the new rear end this weekend, and made some progress.

Used some Easy-Off oven cleaner on it. Sprayed it down real good, let it soak in a while, then used the scraper and scraped the grease, grime and as much of the undercoating and loose rust that I could off the rear end.

I got that thing all over too, I must have used half a can of that stuff on it. Spray it on, let it sit 20 minutes, then rinse it off.

I put the rear back on jack stands in the garage and let it dry overnight.

Last night I went out there and with a can of Dupli-Color Rust Fix, I sprayed it down with two good coats. The Rust Fix is supposed to stop and encapsulate the rust I guess, and turn into a primer. Goes on clear and turns into a black primer when it's done.

I got the front, top, and back of the chunk, axle tubes and backs of the backing plates. Tonight I'll roll the thing over and get the bottom and then tomorrow I can spray it down with the new undercoating, then paint on top of that if need be.

Still got to drain the old gear oil out of it too. Want to do that before I do the final paint. Probably do that today, before I flip it.

I need new bushings, 223k miles the car really needs new bushings for the control arms.

I have also kinda started on getting the gauge cluster started, see my opinion post.

[LWillmann]

More progress...

I got the rear end undercoated:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/undercoat1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/undercoat2.jpg

Then got the control arms sand blasted, primed and under coated too:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/controlarms1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/controlarms2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/controlarms3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/controlarms4.jpg

And then after spending $200 at Harbor Freight on a 20-ton shop press on Saturday so I could get by new bushings pressed in, I spent yesterday afternoon getting the rear end bolted up in the car:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/in_car1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/in_car2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/in_car3.jpg

The only bummer? I am pretty sure I got the springs in upside down. :rrofl:

So, my to do's on the rear end are:

Fix the springs-DONE
Install brakes-DONE
Install wheels-DONE
Put rear on ramps-DONE
Tighten all control arm bolts-DONE
Connect brake lines-DONE
Replace pinion seal-DONE
Install TrickFlow diff cover-DONE
Fill diff with gear oil-DONE
Install sway bar-DONE

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Still Sounds Good Willmann And Looks Good.

[WhiteIrocZ]

I have that same serpentine kit for my car, but with the AC compressor. I have heard of a lot of guys that run it without the smog pump delete pulley or the small idler that goes there but the belt moves around too much for me. I bought a smog pump delete pulley to fix that issue.

[LWillmann]

Do you have the part number for that delete pulley?

[WhiteIrocZ]

GM Partsdirect PN# 10186167.

Try it first, if you don't think you need it, then don't use it. The belt flops back and forth about 3 inches side to side without it, and hundreds of people don't use it. If you do wind up getting it, just buy a belt for an 88-92 V8 Camaro or Firebird, its the same setup as them stock, but I bought mine from GMPP.

[LWillmann]

Made a little more progress over the weekend, well yesterday actually.

Didn't get to work on it Saturday. Too busy working on a web site for a client.

Yesterday, my oldest boy and I flipped the springs to be like they need to be, and the proceeded to install the rear brakes and paint the new brake drums.

I taught my son how to install drum brakes on a car yesterday. He actually installed the passenger side brakes. Did it mostly by himself (I helped in a few spots where he didn't have the strength, but that was it)! Not too bad for a 9 year old.

Here's the pics:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/in_car4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/brakes1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/brakes2.jpg

[LWillmann]

I was informed yesterday that I got those springs at the top of the drum setup backwards. The larger one has to go at the back, and the yellow one on the outside.

Thanks to John_D. for pointing that out!

So last night, I switched their positioning on both sides, put the drums on, and mounted the wheels.

So that's one more thing I can mark off the TO DO list...

Maybe I can get it up on ramps tonight and work on some of the other stuff too.

[Uncle Paul]

Did I miss it already or is the engine not in yet?

[LWillmann]

The engine is not in. it's waiting for the transmission that's being built.

[Uncle Paul]

Ok cool. I didn't know if you were wanting to put in the engine/tranny together or not.

That's a good thing though. I wouldn't want the transmission to sit around for a long time without being run. A seal could dry up and or get twisted in the bore which would prevent clutch packs from being engaged and so on.

Hopefully one of the tools I ordered will come in sooner or later.

[LWillmann]

I hope to get the rear end finished up today.

Going to try and order my aluminum for the dash panel today too.

I'm also going to try and get the steering parts for the front end (inner and outer tie rods, center link, etc) so that I can rebuild the front steering stuff while doing the spring, shock and sway bar install. No way I can get all that stuff and get it in the car, this weekend, but if I can get it picked up, we might have something to work on next weekend, LOL.

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Sounds Good Willmann!!! Throw Some Pics In There If You Can.

[LWillmann]

Made a little more progress tonight...

Got the car on ramps, got the control arms tightened up, and brake lines hooked up.

Then I started working on the pinion seal. I got the pinion nut off, but couldn't get the yoke off before it got too late.

Here's a picture of how the rear looks from the side of the car:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/under_car1.jpg

And here's the rear fender clearance:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/after_install1.jpg

For comparison, here's a picture from before any work began:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/before_install1.jpg

It's really hard to tell the difference, because of the distance and angle, but it really looked like a 4x4 before.

[Uncle Paul]

If you have a universal puller (like from harbor frieght) you can use that to pull the yoke off of the pinion. I use the same universal puller I use for harmonic balancers on yoke's all the time. Works like a champ!

[LWillmann]

I don't have a 'universal' puller.

I have a steering wheel puller, and a harmonic balancer puller. The one with the slots in it, no claws or anything, just a three 'finger' plate with a threaded hole in the center.

I wonder if I can get that to work?

[Uncle Paul]

I don't have a 'universal' puller.

I have a steering wheel puller, and a harmonic balancer puller. The one with the slots in it, no claws or anything, just a three 'finger' plate with a threaded hole in the center.

I wonder if I can get that to work?

My universal puller has 4 slots. It has the 3 slots for a triangle shape 3 bolt pattern and it also has a 4 slot that is directly in line with the first slot for a 2 bolt pattern. That is the part that I use to pull the yoke out with.

Your steering wheel puller might work. Or maybe even a small 2 or 3 jaw puller.

If you can wait till this weekend, I will just bring one of mine with me?

[LWillmann]

I will look at mine this evening to be sure, but if it doesn't have 4 slots (I think it only has three) then I can wait till this weekend.

[Uncle Paul]

Ok, just let me know. :D

[LWillmann]

Had a gathering at the house this weekend, and got some work done.

The night of the gathering at the house, after we ate dinner (I cooked Manicotti for everyone that came), we worked on the car a while. We got the pinion seal replaced, while a couple of guys started getting the front passenger suspension taken apart. But that was all we managed to get done.

Yesterday I installed the pinion yoke, the new diff cover, and the sway bar. So the rear suspension should be complete now.

The rear sway bar installs in a really odd way, check out the pics:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/finished1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/finished2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/finished3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/finished4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/finished5.jpg

Notice that the sway bar bolts in the center of the U channel on the lower control arms, and that there are no bushings to hold it to the rear end. I've never seen a sway bar mount like that.

[BRADSBLACK_SS]

Yeah It's A Little Odd Looking But Everything Looks Jam Up Man.

[LWillmann]

I've gotten several things done here over the last couple weeks, I need to get pics taken and post them. The front suspension isn't as pretty as the rear because I haven't had the time or drive to pull the control arms out to blast and repaint them, which I'm sure would totally kill the alignment, so they're still a littly rusty.

[LWillmann]

Ok, got the steering stuff in over the weekend. I think I have the tie rods at the right length too. The only thing left right now is to grease all the fittings, and tighten up the adjuster sleeves on the tie rods.

Here are a few pics of the front suspension:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/front1.jpg
The sway bar is the thick grey bar, you can see the new idler arm, center link, the new polyurethane motor mounts (used clamshells), and inner tie rod.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/front5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/front2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/front3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/suspension/front4.jpg

In these, you can see the new springs, shocks and the thick as hell sway bar. This puppy measures in at 35mm, it is solid, and is way heavy.

All that's left on the front is new calipers and rubber brake lines for each side.

I'm afraid that I won't be able to get the bleeders open when I go to change the brake fluid. So I'm going to change the calipers out. There's still tons of pad left, so I'm keeping the pads and rotors for now, to save money.

[01BlackBird]

awsome!!!!!!!!! any new updated pics!!!!!!!

[Biff85ta]

Hey get that thing running and tell me how it handles. I am looking to do a drop on my wifes monte carlo but I don't want to hurt the ride on the family car.

[LWillmann]

Made some more prograess today, FINALLY. LOL

Got the drive shaft back together finally. Got the adjuster sleeves on the tie rods tightened up, and the front wheels back on. Cleared the stuff out from unter the rear of the car and got it off the ramps in the back and it's now on all fours again.

As many of you know, I'm replacing the factory long arm speedo with idiot light setup with a set of Auto Meter Sport-Comp gauges that mount in the factory location.

Here are a couple of pictures of the first mockup.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gauge_mockup1.jpg

The tops of the top two gauges (water temp and voltage) are cut off a bit.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gauge_mockup2.jpg

A more direct view of the dash, showing the gauges better.

I might need to bring the top gauges down and in a tiny bit so I can see more of the tops of them while in proper driving position. And bring the speedo and tach up a bit so there's less of the bottom cut off (also make the trip reset easier to get to).

But, when the temp is at the right range, it should be in the center of the gauge or just above center, so I don't have to read the numbers. And I could get into a similar type of routine with the voltage too, I guess.

What do you guys think? Leave it as is, or move them around a bit?

[LWillmann]

Well, I need to update this thread... LOL... I have done a bunch of small stuff to it in the last little while... Let me get the info from the other site.

[LWillmann]

Granted this is a copy/pate from another site, but here's some of the latest:

Swapping from Oldsmobile engine to SBC in my 88 Cutlass.

Have the clamshells mounted in the proper place, per recommendations here and another site.

I do not know if I have...

A) the right block side engine mounts;

or
B) if I do have the right ones, I think I have them mounted on the wrong side of the engine.

We went to drop the engine in the car last night, and couldn't get the mounts to line up right. We got the passenger side to line up, but not the driver side.

Here are two pictures where you can see the block side of the mounts, and see they they are different.
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_inst1.jpg

Now, here you can see how they look in the car (in the same order):
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/pass_mnt.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/drv_mnt1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/drv_mnt2.jpg

Now... Here's what I was told when researching motor mounts for the engine swap... I was told that I could use the block side mounts from a 3rd Gen F-body. That's what these are supposed to be. A buddy who had one sent these to me.

What I'm thinking here is that I've got the mounts on the wrong side of the engine. I'm betting that if I swap sides, the mounts will line up perfect, you folks think I'm right?

[LWillmann]

Looks like the L. side frame mount could be upside down. There is metal tabs that extend outward from the poly inserts (inside frame clamshells) that the block mount(s) flat notches are supposed to rest against when the motor is in position and bolts ready to slide in. Take a look at the R. side mount above the thru-bolt, that looks correct.

The clamshell itself won't mount upside down on the K-member, as the holes are differently spaced at the top and bottom and won't line up upside down. I'm not sure that the L. side mount is upside down, but I do know that when the engine set down on it, the upper tab got messed up, so I pulled the engine back out tonight and took a few pics just in case.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/both_frame_mnts.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/drv_frame_mnt.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/pass_frame_mnt.jpg

So the frame mounts look ok to me, yes?

Now, here are some new, better pictures of the block side mounts:

Driver:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/drv_block_mnt1.jpg

Passenger:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/pass_block_mnt1.jpg

Driver #2:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/drv_block_mnt2.jpg

Passenger #2:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/pass_block_mnt2.jpg

Ok. So that's it.

[LWillmann]

And I got some progress made on the gauges. Got what I think is the final layout in cardboard done.

Need to take pictures and then cut the panel out of the aluminum and get it ready to go in the dash.

[KUTTER]

looks like you got your hands full man frame mount looks fine to me also, look forward to seeing final product

[LWillmann]

I got two 334971's that I ordered from Hawk's yesterday. I'm going to paint them up and see if I can't get the engine dropped in there this weekend (after I get the frame rails painted up).

I've got them primed now. Just got to paint them and the K-member black, then I should be able to drop the engine back down in there.

[KUTTER]

You got to be anxious as hell lol! Keep us posted hope all goes well and no more speed bumps for ya man

[LWillmann]

I still got to get the wiring and conduit for the gauges, and got to get the aluminum panel for the gauges cut and all that.

And I've discovered some small parts under the car missing, stuff that holds the shifter linkage in place. I'll have to snap some pics and get some help there.

[KUTTER]

If you cant find the parts sure its nothing a sedaline torch cant cure.

[LWillmann]

Well, I have verified that the driver's side mount is in fact wrong...

After talking to some people over on another site, who told me that the 334971 mount (the one on the passenger side) worked for them to drop right in to their car (his came from an 87 Monte SS), I called a place and ordered up a set from a car and had them shipped in.

When they came in, I pulled the mount on the driver's side of my engine (different number than 334971) and compared it to the 334971 and here is what I saw...

334971 is the mount on the right in the pic below:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/new_mount.jpg

There is an obvious space difference between the face that bolts to the block (against my knee) and where the through bolt goes through betwee the two mounts. I believe that the mount on the left is a truck mount, but can't confirm it. I'm sure there are other differences, but that's the most obvious.

At this point it doesn't matter, since I have the right mounts, I can clean them up, paint them and get the engine/trans in the car and get back to work getting the car on the road.

Oh yeah, and I've been working on the engine bay a bit too:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/frame_paint1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/mount_probs/frame_paint2.jpg

That one primer spot by the mount on the right is covered now. This is after the first coat of black. I've got to put the 2nd coat on, and and I can proceed forward with engine/trans install.

[LWillmann]

From another board, some time ago...

As many of you know, I'm replacing the factory long arm speedo with idiot light setup with a set of Auto Meter Sport-Comp gauges that mount in the factory location.

Here are a couple of pictures of the first mockup.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gauge_mockup1.jpg

The tops of the top two gauges (water temp and voltage) are cut off a bit.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gauge_mockup2.jpg

A more direct view of the dash, showing the gauges better.

I might need to bring the top gauges down and in a tiny bit so I can see more of the tops of them while in proper driving position. And bring the speedo and tach up a bit so there's less of the bottom cut off (also make the trip reset easier to get to).

But, when the temp is at the right range, it should be in the center of the gauge or just above center, so I don't have to read the numbers. And I could get into a similar type of routine with the voltage too, I guess.Some people recommended putting gauges on the pillar, etc... back then...
----------------------

Fast Forward to this weekend when I took some more pictures.....

----------------------

I don't want to put anything on the A pillar, and I'm already going to have the trans temp gauge in between the two vents to the left of the main cluster (over the stereo, basically center of the car) so I moved these around as best I could. I got down to where I was moving them 1/16 of an inch at a time on the drawing (before cutting the holes out of the cardboard), to get them spaced as evenly as possible, and make them as visible as possible.

The dash trim isn't mounted in these pics, so it's a little low I believe. I can't remember off hand if I was holding it up or not.

Here's the current mockup...

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gauge_mockup3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gauge_mockup4.jpg

[LWillmann]

Made a little more progress here recently...

I got the engine bay painted as best I could for now, I'll finish it out later.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/bay_painted1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_bay/bay_painted2.jpg

Going to clean up and paint the frame rails in the front wheel wells (hopefully tonight) and I should be able to drop the engine and trans in after that.

I also made a little progress on the gauge panel. I have it drawn on the aluminum, but have to get a metal cutting blade for my jigsaw and dremel rotary tool so that I can cut it out.

[LWillmann]

I've GOT to update this.

I'll do that later today. I'm going to do some work on the car first.

I have gotten some stuff done though.

[NEMESISVETTE]

I took the time to go through this thread and I am impressed with this project. You have been very thorough. Using great parts and takin your time.

[Nauty99SS]

http://i303.photobucket.com/albums/nn132/Nauty99SS/gauge_mockup2.jpg

could you mount the gauges on this outside lip so the gauges stand out rather than being down in the square hole .. looks like the bottom of the gauges might be hiden , or maybe it's just the pic's

[The EnforceR]

i agree itd look 10x bettter if you made a bracket that would allow you to mount the gauges flush with that lip instead of it being recessed. looks good still nontheless tho!

[LWillmann]

I'll get pics of the way the dash is designed so you guys can see why I'm doing it the way I am.

[LWillmann]

Ok, so now that I have the new and proper motor mounts installed on the block after painting them. I ran the wire cup brush to the front wheel wells and cleaned them up, then painted them so they look presentable.

Then proceeded to set the engine and tranny into place, and with just a little working of the driver's side mount (just a little rocking up and down), it dropped into place!

A few pics:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car6.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car7.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/eng_in_car8.jpg

Got a little touch up work to do on the pulleys and the upper part of the accessory brackets where the engine hoist rubbed it while going into the car, but it went in nice and easy this time. The headers rubbed a bit going in, but they're cheap so I'm not too worried about them.

I think it looks good in there!

Going to have plenty of room between the engine and that radiator too.

[Ryans_Pewter_SS]

Thats looks very good! Nice work your doing!!!

[NEMESISVETTE]

Its coming along. You must have had more free time this past mth. You have got alot done shortly.

[LWillmann]

I got some pictures of the dash design, like I said I would.

I also got started on cutting the aluminum panel that's going in the dash.

Here's the pics:

Here's the dash with the outer trim bezel removed, the gauge 'box' mounts where the plugs are and the trim face mounts around/over it.
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw2.jpg

Here's the cardboard test panel in place where the factory box would go. The gauge would be level with this panel, but the bubble would extend forward and into the grey trim that mounts to the dash.
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw3.jpg

Here's the grey trim that will mount on the dash. It has that black and silver 'ring' on it. You can also see the aluminum panel in process. My dremel bit broke so I figured I would test fit it.
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw4.jpg

These next two pictures show you the cardboard panel in place with the grey trim in place.
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw5.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw6.jpg

And these show the aluminum panel in place where the cardboard panel was.
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw7.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/gpw8.jpg

After looking at the grey trim piece, I can remove the black/silver bezel and possibly make a aluminum panel that sits level with the other trim in the dash. However, I highly doubt I would have enough room for all 6 gauges to fit there, and I really don't want to put gauges on the pillar. It's bad enough that I'm going to have to put one gauge between the center vents in the dash, cutting the factory plastic (trans temp gauge).

But I'll look at that once I get this panel done and the gauges mounted. This way I can at least get the car on the road and maybe move them later.

[Biff85ta]

Those mounts came right off the block of the 305 out of my 85 TA Lee. I have no idea why that one was different. I literally unbolted them and boxed them up. Sorry they didn't fit I know that had to be a pain to be that close and then have the wrong stuff.

[LWillmann]

It's cool man, no biggie. I ain't mad at ya! :)

I need to get back out there and get to work on it.

I got the rear IROC wheels to mount on the rear of the car without looking retarded too. Look good actually.

I need tires for all 4 of them, and some new center caps.

I also have to decide how I want to visually indicate what gear I'm in. Never planned that out when I was doing my gauge panel. May go with the Dakota Digital setup.

[Biff85ta]

I also have to decide how I want to visually indicate what gear I'm in. Never planned that out when I was doing my gauge panel. May go with the Dakota Digital setup.

Throw a floor shifter in there and be done with it. You need to throw some buckets in there. What ever happened to the seats out of your formy? The will fit you just have to switch the tracks out.

[Biff85ta]

I got the rear IROC wheels to mount on the rear of the car without looking retarded too. Look good actually.



That other set of IROCS still around if so I am interested in them.

[KUTTER]

looking good man good luck on progress as always

[Diggler]

Throw a floor shifter in there and be done with it. You need to throw some buckets in there. What ever happened to the seats out of your formy? The will fit you just have to switch the tracks out.
....after you weld in some mounts for the inner seat tracks.
this thread brings back memories. i need to get back to work on my cutlass. it has been covered up for around 3 years now.

[Biff85ta]

His has a split bench that makes thing much easier.

[Diggler]

ah i gotcha. i had the solid bench in mine. welded in the mounts for seats, shifter and console, put the shifter in the floor and swapped columns.
i ran some 4th gen buckets for awhile but i did not like them as much. they just didnt look "right" in there.

[LWillmann]

Finished up the gauge panel today :D

I had drawn out on the panel where I wanted all my LEDs placed a while back, but was waiting till I had all my LEDs here. Needed my transmission gear indicator and turn signal and high beam LEDs. Once I got them all together, I had a guy at work drill the holes for the LEDs for me a few days ago but the holes he drilled weren't quite large enough so once I got it home I had to slightly enlarge them. Once I got that done, I sanded and clearcoated it.

Tonight, I installed all the LEDs and gauges into the panel and snapped a few pics, and this is the result:

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/mounted_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/mounted_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/mounted_3.jpg

It's hard to see in these pictures, but under the right light and angle, the swirl marks from the palm sander and clearcoat left a very cool effect on the panel depending on how you look at it.

So I guess it's time to wire this sucker up, and get back to work on the car.

[The EnforceR]

thats pretty neat there lee, the paint looks a little splotchy but thats prob just from the bright light i guess.

[Diggler]

very nice! i think im going to try to make my stock gauges work. i think they did before, but some of the lights were a little flaky sometimes.

[LWillmann]

thats pretty neat there lee, the paint looks a little splotchy but thats prob just from the bright light i guess.

Kyle, it's not paint. actually.

All I did to it was to sand it ith 150 grit sandpaper on my B&D palm sander in a circular motion, then shoot it with some clear coat. 2 even coats, and that's the effect that I got.

If you look straight at the panel it looks perfect, but if you look from any angle you get interresting shadows. It's cool as hell, really!

[badjuju342]

Damn , I am going to have to start working on the 'vert again soon...

[LWillmann]

Well, last week I did a test fit on the gauges in the dash. I just sat them in there to see how they look and this is what I found.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/fitment_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/fitment_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/gauges/fitment_3.jpg

So, I found that I should be able to see everything just fine once the spacers for the gauge plate are in and everything is wired up and screwed into place like it should be.

I also did a little work on the car this weekend...

Installed the transmission mount, new crossmember and driveshaft. I then modified my old LT1 dual electric fan shroud to work on the Cutty radiator and set the radiator in the car and test fir the fan shroud in the car to see how well it will work, and turns out that with the fan shroud turned right-side up the bottom fan (driver's side) hits the steering box, but if I flip it, it is fine because the other fan sets furter from the edge of the shroud. The only bummer at the moment is that the wiring is up top, but maybe I can flip the fans in the shroud and put the wiring back at the bottom again. I hope the mounting holes aren't at odd locations on the fans.

So that's what I got done yesterday in a few hours, wasn't much, but it was something. Here's a few pics of the crossmember and the beefiness.

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/xmember/xmember_1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/xmember/xmember_2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/xmember/xmember_3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/xmember/xmember_4.jpg

It's a hefty sucker, that's for sure. The 'humps' for the exhaust tubes are made from 1/2" thick steel. It's certainly a serious crossmember!

[RedBullZ]

How much does that crossmember weigh!?!?

[LWillmann]

30 lbs. The box sections are 3x2 steel.

[Diggler]

that is supa overkill on that crossmember. looks good, though.
i am using a dual hump one from a mid 70's a-body car modified for the narrow g-body frame.

[LWillmann]

I found a set of wheels and tires that I want this weekend. Just need to sell the IROC wheels I have first, so I can afford to get these other wheels.

[RedBullZ]

How about you do a update with the seats you got back from me! :p

[bonesgt]

Man, I just saw this thread, and all I can say is....DAMN I miss my 81 Cutlass now!!!!!

[LWillmann]

How about you do a update with the seats you got back from me! :p

As soon as I can get a chance to get the seats mounted in the car, I'll get pics taken and posted up.

I need to make a list of all the crap that still needs to be done to the car, but I fear I will get discouraged when I see just how long that list is.

I think the single larges thing on that list to do is to build the fuel system, the only components I have are basically the fuel pump (electric), carb, and I think an oil pressure cut off switch.

[LWillmann]

After not being able to touch the car at all for months, I finally got to turn wrenches on it today.

I bought some tires for the Iroc wheels that I have from Ed here on the site. Went to meet Jay, Peeler, and Jay's dad in Sevierville, TN to pick those up this weekend.

This morning, I finally got my headers bolted up. I tried to yesterday but discovered that the bolts I wanted to use would not work, so I had to purchase some new ones. Anyway, got the headers bolted up and moved to the intake manifold. Got it bolted up too.

Then I went to work trying to get the Formula seats bolted up in the car. That was an exercise in frustration.

The Formula seat track width is about 1/2" to 1" narrower than the Cutlass, so I will have to do a little bending on the Cutlass tracks to get the seat to mount in the car. I'll also have to tighten the wire that connects the two tracks to relase the sliders.

[MrDavid]

Just realized its been 6 months since the last update on this thread. Thats too long Lee.

[LWillmann]

Tell that to my life, LMAO.

I have had literally zero time to work on it. I have to keep the boys in the afternoon, plus try to work for my clients (handling service calls and working on web sites). But I'm going to at least try to work on the car on the weekends now, and see if I can get it running.

The fuel system will be the biggest pain I think.

[98chevyman]

good luck man those can be some cool cars if their in the right hands

[Uncle Paul]

Holy Moly! I was looking at some of the dates on the posts. I didn't realize it had been so long since we were out there last.
My fat azz needs to come out there sometime, drink some of your beer, eat more of that lasanga thingy you made and help wrench on the car. :D

[LWillmann]

Holy Moly! I was looking at some of the dates on the posts. I didn't realize it had been so long since we were out there last.
My fat azz needs to come out there sometime, drink some of your beer, eat more of that lasanga thingy you made and help wrench on the car. :D

I'm actually itching for a gathering this spring/summer.

I'm thinking about cooking up some Manicotti for it too. Gotta save up the $100+ it costs me to cook it though.

Trust me though, I'm gonna get the garage together, and we'll plan one.

Maybe I can work it out so we can get some CHO guys to come in? I can get the company hotel discount I think if they wanted to stay in Cookeville.

[Uncle Paul]

If you have a gathering, give me plenty of notice so I can check to see if I am working that weekend, out of town that weekend or not.
Also, I don't mind chipping in for the food and or bring some food/beer to share.

[Biff85ta]

So since you missed this summer how about next summer?

[LWillmann]

The weather is still decent here. And I started working on the garage this weekend. I plan to try and finish it up by the end of the week, so I can get back to wrenching a little on the cutty.

I still have to finish the e-commerce project I've been working on for the past few months so I can get it launched. Once that's launched, I think I will be able to move forward with getting the re-launch here taken care of. Mike and I have a lot planned for this place and I have a ton of stuff lined up, but have to get other stuff out of the way first.

Once the site is officially re-launched, I expect I can get back into full force wrench time on the cutty. That is my plan anyway. I finally have a local car-guy friend now, that really wants to see it run. And as long as I can feed off his positive energy and let him keep me motivated to work on the thing, I'll be able to keep going. Up to this point, the destruction of the Formula has kept me from being real motivated to work on the Cutlass. I could talk about it all day, and once I got started I would work for a while, but getting started was the pain. I think that once I see this thing run and drive, that'll be all the real motivation I need to keep going on it, just like the Formula was. It's just a mental block I think. Kinda hard to describe.

[Biff85ta]

I know all about the mental block. I need to start the body work on my monte and stop some rust issues but it is my driver and taking it down to start working on it is hard for me to do.

[LWillmann]

Been doing some work on the car, here's the latest:

Got a few new pictures to share, explaining what I went through with the radiator hoses. Since I don't have pictures of the coat hangers to show how I did the templates for the hoses, I'll just show the hoses.

First, the OE Cutlass lower radiator hose with about 1.5 -2 inches trimmed off of it to help it fit better:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/lower_hose1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/lower_hose2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/lower_hose3.jpg

Then I started with the upper OE hose and this is how it looked:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/oe_hose1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/oe_hose2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/oe_hose3.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/oe_hose4.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/oe_hose5.jpg

[LWillmann]

2nd part:

So with that one not fitting at all, I went to the 1991 Chevy 2500 large radiator hose:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/2nd_hose1.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/2nd_hose2.jpg

http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/2nd_hose3.jpg

Here is the hose that I ended up with:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/upper_hose1.jpg

And here is my trans cooler almost in its home:
http://www.willmannwebsolutions.com/personal/cutlass/engine_install/trans_cooler1.jpg

[LWillmann]

I still have a long way to go, but I am trying to make some progress.

[LWillmann]

Problems Problems...

Hood is back on the car, and the car looks KICK ASS when sitting on the ground, BUT the hood won't close when the air cleaner is on the engine. I'll post some pics of that soon.

Going to have to have a drop base air cleaner for sure and a shorter air filter to try and see if that will help with the stock hood.

In the meantime, I've been looking for cowl hoods, and cowls in general for the hood. I wanted something 'tasteful', like a 2" cowl, don't want to go Outlaw 6" cowl. I think 4" would be max for me realistically.

Someone gave me a 1" carb spacer and a K&N velocity stack, but I can't run them on the car because of my hood issue, LOL. At least till I get my cowl hood.

To do the fuel system the way I want, it's gonna run me about $600. That's -AN all the way, with the proper fittings and everything. But I may have to try save some costs to get the car running and get some cheaper fittings and just run rubber fuel line and go that route to see if I can get it running.

I have to drop the trans again too, got to take it to a trans shop to get the 1-2 shift servo installed properly. Something about this transmission, if that servo isn't installed right, you don't get 2nd gear because it has to catch the band right.

Going to start working on installing sensors and wiring just as soon as I get time, now that I'm moved and can breath.

Also going to start working to plan a gathering to see if I can get the guys together for some food, wrenching and good company.

[ZZ4CutlaSS]

Nice project! Just my two cents you should buy hoses for a Monte Carlo with a 5.0. I purchased hoses for a 87' Monte and they worked with out modifications.
http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t151/nascarforever3_2002/Photo0366.jpg

[ZZ4CutlaSS]

Is this project done yet?

[Biff85ta]

The car has been on the backburner for a while cause of a move and a car accident. I actually have a column, console and floor shifter he is supposed to get from me. I might be starting a build thread of my own before too long. I just need to order some headers, a crossmember and dual exhaust for my monte and the tear old the old 4.3.

P.S. Did you use the cutlass lines and condensor for the AC on your car?

[ZZ4CutlaSS]

The car has been on the backburner for a while cause of a move and a car accident. I actually have a column, console and floor shifter he is supposed to get from me. I might be starting a build thread of my own before too long. I just need to order some headers, a crossmember and dual exhaust for my monte and the tear old the old 4.3.

P.S. Did you use the cutlass lines and condensor for the AC on your car?

Bummer I hope he gets his project done. Yes I used A/C lines and conndensor from a 87' 442. Put now I decided not to run the A/C since I started the frame off restoration.

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t151/nascarforever3_2002/100_0762.jpg
http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t151/nascarforever3_2002/100_0760.jpg
http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t151/nascarforever3_2002/IMG_20111204_143842.jpg
http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t151/nascarforever3_2002/100_0744.jpg

[Biff85ta]

I wish I could take mine down that far. It might happen if I can find another DD to drive while the progress is made. Thanks for the info on the AC lines it will make the swap to serpentine go much easier. My swap will just be a pretty basic 350 tbi swap just to make a good cruiser out of the car.

[LWillmann]

Unfortunately, my car has made virtually no progress for more than a year.

I need to get the engine all wired up, get the dash wired, finish the other interior changes that I plan to make (seats, console, etc), and get the fuel system done. I think at that point I could actually start it.

I need the transmission looked at again to be sure everything is 100% before I drive it.

There is a lot that needs to be done, but my current living situation doesn't afford me much of an ability to work on it and put the money into it that it needs.

[LWillmann]

I have discovered that with the 350 under the hood, the carb and the air cleaner I originally chose for the engine, the hood will not close with the air cleaner on the carb.

I'm going to have to pick up a drop base for the air cleaner at the very least if I want to use the stock hood.

However I think I'm going to go with a cowl hood for the car and run the air cleaner I have.

[ZZ4CutlaSS]

I have discovered that with the 350 under the hood, the carb and the air cleaner I originally chose for the engine, the hood will not close with the air cleaner on the carb.

I'm going to have to pick up a drop base for the air cleaner at the very least if I want to use the stock hood.

However I think I'm going to go with a cowl hood for the car and run the air cleaner I have.

I have a drop plate for my air cleaner. Do you have any current pics? Kinda curious how your intake compars in height to mine.